This week, we’re sitting down with writer and animator Ken Pontac. His decades-long list of credits includes The New Adventures of Gumby, Bump in the Night, Clayfighter, Lazytown, the ultraviolent Happy Tree Friends and the even more ultraviolent MadWorld.

We asked him to pontificate on Hollywood, cartoons and inadvertently creating a YouTube meme, and he obliged.

Kwanzoo: So, why animation?

Ken: I grew up loving animation, and had a pal in school that was into it as well. His name is David Ichioka, and we’ve been pals since we were 7. Still are.

We started making cartoons in between watching them and never stopped.

Kwanzoo: Gumby was your first commercial show you were involved in, right? How did you get involved with that?

Ken: I was an Ad Design major at Art Center in Pasadena in the late 70’s. My roommate at the time and I saw a midnight show of Eraserhead and were inspired to make a film that would show before it. I cut all my classes and made a clay animated film that we ended up showing to Art Clokey. One thing led to another and I became the Art Director for the New Adventures of Gumby.

Cut your classes, kids!

Also, I ended up dropping out of Art center.

Drop out of school, kids!

Kwanzoo: What was the animated film you made about?

Ken: It was called “Free Taco”. Kevin Mack (Oscar winner for “What Dreams May Come,” David Ichioka (nee: Bleiman) and I were the entire crew. It was (kind of) about how things break down in an apartment when a guy zaps a vivisected dog’s brain with electricity. Kind of. We were on a lot of drugs back then…

It ended up showing before Eraserhead, though. Which was cool.

Kwanzoo: The David Lynch film, right?

Ken: Yes. HUGE inspiration to our acid addled brains!

Saw it on every drug available at the time.

Stay off drugs, kids!

Kwanzoo: Which is kinda odd, since it seems like you went on to do a whole lot of children’s shows.

Ken: Ha ha! Everything from pre-school to MadWorld and HTF.

I don’t do drugs now. I get The Fear.

Although drugs and writing for animation are not mutually exclusive…

Kwanzoo: So, what did you do after Gumby?

Ken: We made a three minute film pitching our own show, “The Danger Team.” Took it to Hollywood where the one guy we knew who could get us a meeting added his own soundtrack and titles to the film without telling us.

We took a meeting at Viacom and saw the edited version at the same time as the exec we were pitching to. We were shocked. Too young and inexperienced to halt the meeting, which is what I’d do now. Fired the guy in the parking lot.

Went back to the basement of the pal whose place we were staying at. Pal had a lawyer, Andy Jonas. Andy saw the film, says, “My brother Tony would love this.”

Got a meeting with Tony. VP Dramatic Development at Disney! Did we ever sleep in the right basement!

Tony loved the short, got us a meeting at ABC. We sold the show “in the room,” as they say!

Tony went on to become president of Warner Brothers TV. The pilot crashed and burned.

David and I got term deals at WB and developed shows for a year.

Kwanzoo: Does that happen in Hollywood a lot, people trying to bully you around by adding their own input without telling you?

Ken: Hollywood can be very ugly. We knew we had something good as soon as somebody tried to steal it.

We got hooked up with an executive producer on the same show who talked so much as if the whole thing was his idea. People were surprised when they found out that David and I were the creators of the show.

Kwanzoo: I guess people are just desperate to latch on to something resembling actual creativity.

Ken: Yes. People take.

The end result was the most AWFUL, hagged out crap. The worst cliches of bad Hollywood writing. A real learning experience for a couple of young guys!

Kwanzoo: This is the pilot?

Ken: Yes. We weren’t allowed any real creative input. Weren’t allowed to write. We were just the trained monkeys who knew the trick of making puppets come to life.

Kwanzoo: Where did you go after that? After WB, I mean.

Ken: Back to the Bay Area to lick our wounds. We created the characters and animation for a video game called “ClayFighter.”

Around that time we were invited to speak at a panel about Prime Time animation (the Danger Team was a Prime Time show). Matt Groening, the guys whop did “Fish Police” and a bunch of other guys were there.

In the audience was an exec from ABC saturday Morning named Jennie Trias. She was impressed with the stop motion stuff, as well as how cheaply we did the Gumby episodes. Invited us to pitch a show.

We came up with a stop motion show about the monster under the bed and his pal who lives in the toilet. The show was called “Bump in the Night.”

She loved it, and once again, we sold it in the room! Two season commitment. Picked up for another two after that.

Then Disney bought ABC and they cancelled the show in the middle of season three production.

We got 26 episodes and a Christmas special out of the deal, though.

Kwanzoo: Getting jerked around just when you think you’re all set seems to be another Hollywood theme.

Ken: Oh yes.

The way they cancelled the show was BRUTAL.

Phone call in the morning from LA: “There are guys in suits landing at SFO in the next hour. They’re gonna shut down the show.”

Suits arrive, we gather the staff. Suits say, “Everybody leave the building and meet at the restaurant next door. Lunch is on us ’cause we’re such nice guys. Don’t come back for your stuff until Monday after we change the locks and post a guard at the door.” Brutal.

People were sobbing, calling their agents, walking around like a bomb went off. Couple of great years working on the show, though.

Kwanzoo: How do you adapt to that sort of environment, where you just can’t trust anyone?

Ken: You try not to be bitter, but to question everything, and anticipate every scenario. It’s part of the deal if you want to work in the industry.

I don’t consider myself bitter at all. Just very realistic.

The good outweighs the bad, by a lot. If that changes I’ll bail.

Kwanzoo: Where did you go after Bump in the Night got cancelled?

Ken: I wrote scripts for other people’s shows (something I still do), and then David and I directed a Christmas special for Will Vinton Studios.

We also did the animation for that annoying Microsoft Office agent that looks like Einstein. I apologize to the world for that.

Kwanzoo: Yeah, when I saw Microsoft Office on your credits, I was going to ask if you were responsible for the paper clip.

Ken: NO.

Not the clip! Einstein and the cute little robot.

Kwanzoo: How did you get involved with Happy Tree Friends?

Ken: The show had been around for a while, long enough for two DVD compilations, before I even knew about it.

I saw it online and wrote the creators a fan letter. They were fans of some of the stuff I’d done, so a love-fest ensued. One thing led to another, and now I’ve been writing for HTF for years.

That’s something I try to tell any group I’m speaking to when I lecture: contact the people you admire. You never know who you’ll meet and how they’ll change your life.

Art Clokey (creator of Gumby), Happy Tree Friends, Willaim Burroughs, Tim Leary, Jim Woodring… I’d never had met any of them (and more) if I hadn’t made the first move.

Kwanzoo: How do you know Jim Woodring?

Ken: I wrote him a fan letter!

Funny thing, too. In the box of stuff I sent with the letter was a headshot from my Hollywood Extra days. His wife saw it and recognized me as the guy who came to her niece’s wedding blazing on acid, years before I wrote to Jim. Niece and I went to high school together.

Kwanzoo: Wow.

Ken: Small world!

Jim ended up designing the logos and some characters for Bump in the Night.
Amazing artist, and quite a character!

Kwanzoo: So, was HTF the most hyper-violent thing you’d written for?

Ken: Pretty much.

The upcoming MadWorld from Sega is pretty violent. Comes out the 10th of this month. So violent it makes HTF look like a public service announcement.

Kwanzoo: How did the MadWorld thing happen?

Ken: My cousin Martin Caplan works at Sega. Heard they needed an American writer for MadWorld. Hooked me up.

Kwanzoo: I wanted to ask you about “the line.”

MadWorld is intentionally over the top. When you asked where the line was on what you could write, they was there wasn’t one. Then once they’d saw some scripts, they came back and said “Ok, yeah, there’s a line.” Something like that?

Ken: Yes. They threw down a gauntlet. There’s ALWAYS a line.

Let’s just say that the Japanese revere their mothers in a way that Americans don’t, and certain interactions between mothers (and daughters, and grandmothers) and football teams is off the table.

As is the Pope.

And Hitler.

Kwanzoo: Would you say that deep down, you are a horrible, horrible man?

(This is the ambush phase of the interview.)

Ken: Deep down we are all very bad monkeys. A friend of mine suggested a tee shirt for me: “Id -motivated.”

But, no. I think I’m a very good man. I’m just a very bad wizard.

I yield right of way. I bag my own groceries (in bags I bring myself). I bring soup to the old lady upstairs. What I write is entertainment (for some people, anyway).

Back when I was in advertising I always said there were three things I wouldn’t work on: Cigarettes, Religion, and War. I never did.

Kwanzoo: Do you ever have to face down mobs of furious pitchfork-wielding mothers who have mistaken HTF for a children’s show?

Ken: No, but we get hate mail. We even compiled a bunch of it as a DVD bonus! Lemonade from lemons.

Bitter, bitter lemons.

Kwanzoo: So, along the way, you wrote what became an Internet meme? “You Are A Pirate.”

Ken: Yes!

Kwanzoo: Did you see that one coming?

Ken: No!

What a trip!

I was in Iceland, working on this crazy show called LazyTown, and they gave me a pirate song to write. I love all things piratical, so the song was a snap.

Now it’s all over the Internets, with drunken karaoke versions, mash-ups, and everything.

These guys made it a drinking game.

This is just adorable:

And this one TERRIFIES me.

The German language version is a hoot.

Kwanzoo: Here’s something I’ve been wondering: Is there any money in writing an Internet meme?

Ken: No money from YouTube (GOD, I wish!) I get ASCAP royalties for the song when it’s on TV, though.

Kwanzoo: South Park did this episode that was basically “Ha ha, there’s no money in internet videos” (which you can watch on their web site after an Old Spice video ad.)

Ken: Those guys have plenty of money.

Kwanzoo: I’m not sure if YouTube is profitable for Google yet or not, so I’m wondering.

Well, I’ve done my share for them. “Pirate” has had tens of millions of hits if you add up all the versions.

I’m not mad about it. I love all the energy the song has created.

Kwanzoo: So they actually flew you out to Iceland to work on that?

Ken: Yes. It was crazy. A magic month.

Kwanzoo: What’s in the future for you?

Ken: Um, the future’s uncertain and the end is always near…

But right now I’m writing for a kids’ action/adventure show called Matt Hatter Chronicles.

I love that stuff. I never grew up, so this sort of show resonates in my brain.

Kwanzoo: What’s the state of American animation right now? I heard Nick closed down their studios?

Ken: It’s a tough world. Matt Hatter is being produced in the UK.

A lot of stuff that I’d love to write for (and whose story editors would love me to write for) can only be worked on by Canadians.

That being said, entertainment does pretty well even in hard times. I’m still pitching to Disney and Cartoon Network, and they’re still looking for shows.

Kwanzoo: Any words you want to get in edgewise before we wrap up?

Ken: Um… Don’t forget to write to your heroes, kids!

I’m on Facebook. Join my mob!

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